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My brother has the Doyle Stack Pack on a Cal 39 – he had it made for the boat by Doyle for a new “Doyle” Main sail. The cost to “integrate” the existing main sail seemed to be not a great value for him….Doyle pricing was a high/low cost at the time – that may have changed. Shipping/transit/fees, ect….and if anything does not work..finger pointing …I suspect that it’s a more refined process now.
That said, he loves the unit & all works well.
Based on how much he liked his sail cover, we looked into the “stack pack” Idea for our Dickerson. We had just bought a new set of sails…We did not want to “retrofit”via Doyle. We went with a non-attached unit that is independent of the main sail – A nice one out there is made by MACK sails in Fla. They call it the “Mack Pack”…It’s works on any sail. We have this style on the Main & Mizzen….they work fine. Unzip, raise the sail – drop the sail – zip up.
Mack has a good website & are nice guys to deal with.….Both do a nice job.
For ideas on hydraulics I’d take a look at what’s inside a Whitby 42…They have a couple forums on the web & lots of info on the hydraulic steering system as installed new & that folks have “upgraded”. Only issue is hydraulics are “dead” to feel, but, easy to incorporate autopilot. Whitby seem to have “issues” with steering so there is lots of info out there…
Edson also makes a push/push (or pull/pull..point of view) system you might want to take a look at. Might be easier than hydraulics….nothing to leak.
The issue with the old “Dickerson style” teak box steering pedestals is that you will have to chase down either a bulkhead mount or a dual bearing steering wheel to chain drive assembly and “modify” it to fit. I had an extra bulkhead unit that I just sold…I’m pretty sure they don’t make them anymore (the old style bronze bulkhead mount).
Me…I’d call Edson for a chat. They have always been great to deal with and it’s amazing what “stuff” they have tucked away in their warehouse.
Pedestal sizing is pretty straight forward. As you know, its just a box. If interested I can send dimensions of mine (from a D36). I suspect you could make what ever size “fit” your boat & it would look fine.
Non skid….I’ve heard lots of good things about KiwiGrip. A buddy of mine did an Alberg 35 with it…still in the “repair shed” but looks very nice – water base & easy to apply. I wonder how easy to keep clean…..Folks that have it like it. I’ve asked around about this same subject and the easiest to keep clean is Awlgrip & grip additive – but, a lot of work to apply and the substrate must be able to take 2 part paint..
Fun is!
MikeJohn
Love a guy with a sense of humor…..
I had a sailfish in the 70’s that had foam in the mast – definitely helped right the boat when it capsized. Perhaps I ought to put one of those big round foam balls on the top of each mast, kinda’ like the old Prindle cats, to make sure the masts don’t get stuck in the mud.
MikeNot Fair all around…Us folks up north ought to get some kind of BDC (bloody damn cold) handicap….Al Sampson will agree ( I hope)
That said…Did not know Joe was down south…I’d have offered to carry his bags!! We got another 8 inches of snow yesterday….The piles out front…well, they are tall and white…..
Today was “basement time” getting some trim organized and getting the new Head ready to go in… Spring is on the way!Love the “limited” forum…not so much “delete” work…
I’m going to agree with Al….dig out as much as you can……
If Al says Balsa, I’ll defer to him…..
Wet core presents huge challenges. If its “end grain” basa (BALTEK), hopefully the water only compromized the squares adjacent to the thru hull…end grain balsa “tends” to not allow water to tranfer throughout the whole deck, unless it travels along the inner/outer skin. Wire “digging” tools and chisels & anything you can use to “reef” ot the core…If its a 1 1/2 inch thru hull you can use a dremel & wheel Or (my favorite) a high speed grinder & disk that’s 1 1/4 inch dia. gets you 3/4 inch all around the hole pretty quick. spins at 22,000 rpm…so care is needed.
I’d mix up a blend of chopped/milled glass fibers, cabosil & epoxy to a “peanut butter” consistency & use that a filler….use the edges of the existing hole as your guide & fill to the edge of the hole tillfull….This will be a very strong compression ring of epoxy/glass ……. Then just sand the hole sides, and reinsert thru hull…..
Also, after you “reef” out the junk, throw a 100 watt light on it for a day …perhaps 8 inches away…to see if there is any moisture the heat might drive away…..Makes the area “dry” for epoxy too……
A plastic hammer “tapping” ( tap fairly hard..) around the hole will give you a decent idea on wet core…the sound does not “ring” like good core…more of a “thump”….Try it and listen for “sound” differences……
Never fun…..
Me……I use 5200 on all thru hulls….I bevel the hole edge to hold more sealant. To remove…Bronze with a propane torch….plastic I cut off with a big chisel……I don’t want leaks….
MikeGreetings Dave…Welcome to the forum…I’m sure the “boys” from down south of the Mason/Dixon line will chime in RE: what is the name of your boat & PLEASE join the Dickerson Association. All good stuff!!
IRIS, our 1973 Dickerson 36 had a club foot rig set up when made -There was a “club” bracket on the headstay above the turnbuckle – but the prior owner had removed the club rig & just went with “standard” jib/Genoa set-up. I thought very hard about putting the “club-foot” rig back in place when I had all new sails made for the boat 4 years ago. I went with a new Furler (the boat was all hank-on sails) and a high cut 135 genoa (we sail in Buzzards Bay -windy all summer)….which has worked very well for us. There is plenty of “drive” and I’ve found that the new sails “changed the boat” – faster, flatter sailing. I did not want a “hard boom” up on my foredeck to contend with…..just me.
I have jibs that are pretty much the same size you mention sitting in the attic in sail bags….That’s pretty common sizing, I think for the 35/36. My old 10’3″ (or so) sail had grommets at the bottom of the sail with sail track sliders ( to hold it on the club)…An interesting arrangement. I’d suspect today there is no real need for the sliders…Kinda’ like a more modern loose footed mainsail that most sailmakers now like….
The club foot design was used by Dickerson, Cape Dory/Robinhood marine, as well as may other builders as a method to make the head sail “self-tending”..Which is a delightful & easy sail to use -especially when sailing short handed. No winches needed when tacking – turn the wheel…and off you go on a new tack….easy. The boom helps keep the sail full a bit when off the wind ( and Hoyt improved that on his patented”jib-boom” design).
Google “herreshoff Newport 29” – made by Brion Reiff in Maine..That boat has a beautiful “non – clubbed” self tending Jib set-up – pretty nice since there is nothing to “whack” you on the head if up on the foredeck. This is a nice set-up – I see no need for a club.
The dimension from mast to headstay dictates the boom clearance…..and if you install a traveler or Mule to anchor the boom its going to be just in front of the mast & behind the fore hatch……Most of the “drive” to weather on a headsail is derived from the leading edge of the sail – that’s the key to “blade” jibs…you might find that a thinner/taller sail sails better than a “fatter” shorter sail . I think the headstay on the 35/36 is about 40 feet.
So..a long answer to a short question…I suspect if you are going to use the club, the foot of the sail is dictated by the length of the club…I’d measure what you have & fit to that & you will probably be fine.
Another consideration…Many of the older dickersons headsails seemed to (as shown in my builder’s drawing) not hoist headsails to the top of the mast…helped to keep the center of effort lower, perhaps. More recent, modern, sails often do hoist to the top of the mast. I’d suspect a good sailmaker could provide good insight for a jib design/cut for you based on how/where you sail.
Hope this is of some help…
MikeIf anyone south of Boston is interested, I’ll go take a look….
A shame to see a good boat fade away……Something to think about…Using a quality butyl tape instead of caulk.
I’ve used it for most of my “fasten down” fixtures like cleats, windlass and stanchion bases over the years. It’s easy and quick (and I don’t have to use a whole tube of “goop” for one little item) and I’ve never seen it fail. For stuff like bedding down hatches or the toerails I’m re-setting, I’ll use sikka…by the tube.
Here is a link that gives a GREAT “how to” for butyl tape….He has lots of other “how to’s” on this site that are well worth the read.
http://www.pbase.com/mainecruising/rebedding_hardware
I sold a bunch of GSO fiberglass backing plates to this guy last fall and had a delightful conversation about various “boat” projects & systems….he has a great how to on using a solar panel to keep batteries up to full charge. (he goes by “Mainsail” on line). Very nice guy & very knowlegeable about many boat related projects. He’s an independent ABYC contractor in southern/coastal Maine.
MikeMalone,
My floor boards are “packed” and on the way to you!! (what was your address again??)
Beautiful!!Iris also had a big “block D” with 36 inside and the boat number # 26 mounted below.
The new mainsail has no insignia or numbers at all (bad mike & una!! )….perhaps Santa ought to bring me one this year…….I’ve been very good this year..
I remove a lot of spam while drinking a cup of coffee in the AM checking e-mail at the office……Guess I’ll check more often during the holidays since it seems everyone wants us to spend all our $$ on “stuff” for Christmas (welcome to the new world of consumerism) ……My sense is that the more “limits” we place on the board the more involvement needed by our “webmaster”….He does a great job and probably does not need additional aggravation….I’ll check a bit more often….
Electrics are a fascinating option. I’ve bumped into a couple guys on the lakes in NH that have “lake boats” that are all electric…Very interesting technology. I’ve followed the thread for years…Motors are better & Batteries (the key) are better/cheaper…..I’ll be interested to see what he ends up with.
I’d suspect that the Prop conversation is a “moot” point if he goes to electric, since he will probably need new prop, shafting, ect to “marry” to the electrics motor … …that being said the electrics might work…since the 4-107 hp/output curve at 1600 rpm , figuring tranny efficiency loss, ect is probably around 16 “brake hp” …I looked at my books last night (for fun) and between Skene & Dave Gerr the HP requirements for the Dickerson would be around 4HP per displacement ton….12,000lbs/2= 6 * 4 = 24 HP…..running that at 70% is around 18.5 hp….The big issue will be prop speed/torque.
The westerbekes in these old boats (4-107 or 4-108) were probably a bit oversize, but were “the best option/value” at the time. Skene figures in transmission loss, ect into his formulas….I would not be surprised if the Electric folks are talking about a motor in the 18 HP range….Probably a reasonable diesel re-power for these boats is a 3 cyl diesel in the 28/30 HP range…..I find this a fascinating exercise.
Love to hear more.
Mike